Welcome to Interviews With My Ex-Girlfriend, in which Autostraddle writers get back in touch with their ex-girlfriends to ask them Five Simple Questions:
How long did we date?
Why did we break up?
What did you learn from our relationship?
What do you miss most about me?
Would you invite me to your wedding (why/why not)?
Holden and I met through a queer mentoring collective that had been started by a Ph.D student for his dissertation work. The mentoring collective fell apart, but the two of us have remained close since. We both have a love for 1970s musical theatre, outlandish gospel music, and Hall & Oates. I got them to stay over in my on-campus apartment for the first time by just happening to have a spare toothbrush. I tried to know them better than I knew myself, which ultimately led to our breakup, but getting to know them was the wildest and best ride I’ve taken thus far.
Alaina: Okay, so what do you want us to call this? Interview with my ex… with just my ex, why not just “my ex.” Because I’m not a girl anymore and you’re not a girl anymore and we’re just… with my “ex person.”
Holden: We’re just two non-girls.
Alaina: Two non girls. Two Non Blondes! Interview with two non-girls. Done. Okay. How long did we date?
Holden: We dated for…we dated for a year.
Alaina: Yep.
Holden: We dated for one year.
Alaina: One year, it was almost exactly one year, it was a little longer than one year… like a year and a month or something like that. Why did we break up?
Holden: We broke up…
Alaina: This is such an interesting question! I love hearing people’s answers to this on Autostraddle. I have an answer too, but I want to hear your answer.
Holden: We … from my positionality, we broke up because the relationship felt like it was toxic. And it felt like that toxicity was not going to change with things continuing the way that they were. I know I had felt that way for a while. And actually before we broke up that time we had broken up before…
Alaina: Yes! Yeah. True, I forgot about that. Yeah, I think it was definitely a toxic relationship — wait, were you saying more? Did you have more?
Holden: I was going to say yeah, like we broke up before and then we like actually broke up again that was like when we like broke up broke up.
Alaina: Right yeah. ‘Cause I feel like we didn’t technically like break up until like January… of 2013.
Holden: The process was … it was long.
Alaina: It was an extended process!
Holden: It was, which is the way it is! Particularly with queer folks!
Alaina: It was like me. I was in a rough place. I think it was like a toxic relationship and I think it was toxic because we stopped talking. Like I stopped talking because I didn’t wanna burden you, and I think you stopped talking about how my not talking burdened you. So I wasn’t telling you how I felt and then you were like “I have to take care of them because they’re clearly going insane, but like I can’t tell them that this is stressing me out.” And all I wanted to do was take care of you and all you wanted to do was take care of me and neither of us were taking care of ourselves. And then it was like “okay, well neither of us are talking to each other, and Alaina’s being abusive and threatening to kill themselves every five minutes, and this can’t work anymore.”
Holden: Yeah.
Alaina: Yeah. I think that’s exactly what happened. I’m glad we broke up though, to be honest. we’re better friends.
Holden: Mhmm, I agree with that. I think it was like… yeah. I think it was a really good thing.
Alaina: I do too. Okay, so as a tie-in, what did you learn from our relationship?
Holden: Oh wow, what did I learn?
Alaina: I know, these are such good questions!
Holden: I learned that you can’t save people? You can’t help people who either don’t want to help themselves or don’t know how to help themselves in that moment so whenever you do try to do that a lot of times it can be more harmful than helpful.
Alaina: Mmm.
Holden: I think that at least I can speak for me a lot of resentment got built up…
Alaina: A lot of resentment… yeah, absolutely.
Holden: Um, you know, and that felt kind of—
Alaina: It was gross. We had an awful like eight months. After. And it wasn’t even like when …it was like after we broke up but we were still living together. But it wasn’t even right after we broke up. It was when we moved here [Note: My ex and I lived together — even moved into a new house together — for almost a year after our breakup because we were young and a mess.] It was when we moved here! It was awful.
Holden: It’s really hard, especially when you really care about somebody and you really want the best for them. You want what’s best for them and you think that maybe you can help them get that? Or get to that place? And then you realize that you can’t, and you’re like “Well then fuck it, okay.” But you still want to be there for them because you see them hurting and so you want to be there, you want to try and help, but you know there isn’t really much you can do and so it’s like what do you do?
Alaina: Right, ugh!
Holden: How do you address it? Do you keep your mouth shut? Do you say something?
Alaina: Straight people don’t think about this.
Holden: Huh?
Alaina: Straight people don’t think about shit like this. Which is crazy! Like to them it’s just, “oh you’re being a bitch.”
Holden: Yeah, and it’s definitely I knew it wasn’t just “Alaina’s being a bitch.” I was fully aware that there was a lot of shit going on that you weren’t telling me about, but I also knew that I was kind of at a place where there wasn’t much that I could do or say that would make the situation better.
Alaina: Yeah.
Holden: And that you kinda had to go through your own process of going through that, even if that own process was like hurtful or harmful to me and you and whatever type of relationship we have or we had. But I never thought it would be something where we’d never speak to each other again, because I feel like we had both invested so much in like cultivating a relationship with one another that we really appreciated the goodness that we had, because I mean … it was good, it was really good.
Alaina: It was really good when it was good.
Holden: Yeah, and so even though there might be things where it was really hard, we always came back to that goodness and were able to see that, particularly because we both really respect each other.
Alaina: Yeah. I agree with that.
Holden: I could never in a million years say you don’t respect me, you know?
Alaina: Yeah. Never. I could never that about you either because I don’t believe that at all… That was good, you learned good stuff.
Holden: What did you learn?
Alaina: I learned… I learned everything that you learned. I also learned for me personally in a relationship I have to bring something up immediately when I’m feeling it or I won’t do it all because I’ll stress myself out about it and then I won’t talk. And I can’t not talk if I want to be in a healthy relationship, I have to communicate; which is why I broke up with [redacted] because I was like no, we have to do this because I’m not gonna be angry at you from now until whenever you decide to end this relationship because that’s not gonna be good for us at all. Like, I can’t start something where I’m feeling scared or angry, or depressed or suicidal even though it has nothing to do with you, I have to say it, or else the relationship will not work. So I’ve learned that like, there has to be 100% open communication in whatever relationship I’m in now, or it’s not gonna work. I bring that to every relationship now. If it’s more than fuck buddies, I bring it in there.
Holden: (laughs) Mhmm.
Alaina: Um, okay, hair flip, what do you miss most about me?
Holden: (laughs)
Alaina: This is my favorite question.
Holden: Ummmm…
Alaina: I can go first. I know what miss most about you. It’s how much I could talk to you. It doesn’t matter about what, just anything. I just came over here and we were talking about race and gender and theology and I love this. I’m always learning from you. No one since you has like… moved my mind as much as you. I know I shouldn’t say this, but a lot of the studs I’ve known just care about cars and bitches. Like, okay?
Holden: Aw thank you. That feels good.
Alaina: Yeah, like, you’re incredibly — I’ve learned so much from you.
Holden: Um, I miss the fact that like we have… we’re so different but so similar at the same time, so like that’s something I always appreciated. Like there were definitely things we have the same taste in, and have similar experiences with a lot of things. And your sense of humor is so dry and hilarious, it’s great. It is very you. And I definitely miss those things and being able to share that with you. Because even on your worst day, you just will find the really dark point and find humor in that. Which is why I love the fact that you act and are involved in theatre, because it’s so dry and very much so… Alaina. You are very much so your own person.
Alaina: Thank you.
Holden: Yeah, you really are very much so your own person.
Alaina: That’s a huge compliment. Thank you.
Holden: You’re welcome. And I can definitely appreciate that about you.
Alaina: That was such a good question to ask each other! Thanks Autostraddle! Aww, we both feel really good after that I think! Okay, and this is the last question. At this point in our relationship would you invite me to your wedding? Wait, and I have an amendment. Wait, no, first you have to answer. Would you invite me to your wedding?
Holden: Would I invite you to my wedding? Yes.
Us at an actual wedding
Alaina: What would I be in your wedding?
Holden: Oh, okay…
Alaina: If I was something. You could just say a guest.
Holden: If you were something you would be….you would be a guest. You could possibly sing…
Alaina: Oh, okay. I’ll sing you a little something!
Holden: *sings* If you like it then you shoulda put a ring on it!
Alaina: Exactly! I’ll sing “Single Ladies” a la Liza Minelli.
Holden: If you sing that our wedding is basically gonna become Sex and the City because I’m gonna sing “Sunrise Sunset.”
Alaina: Of course you are. What else would you sing?
Holden: Nothing.
Alaina: Good. I would invite you to my wedding. You would be like, the ring bearer. Like you could wear a blazer with some shorts. Or maybe not even a blazer, just a vest. Like a vest and a collared shirt and some shorts. And penny loafers. You’d be my ring bearer.
Holden: To add context to this y’all, I am 25 years old and I am a staggering 5 foot 3. I actually found out I grew an inch.
Alaina: Good for you! I think you’d be a great ring bearer. So look out for that in if-I-ever-get-married years.
Holden: Well you’re supposed to be marrying the person who will become the president, right?
Alaina: Right, so it’s a large duty. I don’t wanna pick the wrong president. Because I’m not just picking a wife, I’m picking the next leader of America.
Holden: Yeah. Big job… Wait, so that’s it?
Alaina: Yep, that’s it!
Holden: Oh, I thought there would be more questions.
Alaina: Nope. Easy.
Holden: Cool.
These are always ALWAYS such a great read. Thank you so much for sharing.
What cuties you both are! Thanks for sharing this intimate peek into your relationship and friendship. I loved the parts about what you learned from dating each other, even though you had a long and messy breakup!
This interview was so casual and fun. Thank you!
It also hit a deep pit for me, because I left a similarly toxic relationship over a year ago, and I really hope we can become friends like y’all are in the future.
This is my fave from this series :)
I’m glad you both made it through to be so kind and wise.
So sweet!
I’ve never had a long break up. It normally goes, we should break up, then we’re broken up.
This series makes me look forward to the day I have an ex that I could interview. All my exes now would be like, what? No.
Maybe you need long break ups for that.
Love this!
YAY Another Interview with my Ex =) <333333 I love reading these, they are just the cutest!!
“I learned that you can’t save people? You can’t help people who either don’t want to help themselves or don’t know how to help themselves in that moment so whenever you do try to do that a lot of times it can be more harmful than helpful.”
— SHOUT IT FROM THE ROOFTOPS
I really appreciate how much people share through these. There are just so many things to relate to and so much to learn! Definitely one of my favorite series.